In a weird twist, Toronto fans want the Columbus Crew to pay for the damage that TFC fans caused.
I tried to sweep this whole thing under the rug and not be one of those people that blindly blames Toronto fans. But after reading this piece from a Toronto website that says, "As I write this, TFC supporters’ groups are finalizing a formal response to the city of Columbus, Ohio, and its threat-happy police force. It’s simple, practical, and will cost the Columbus Crew soccer team and their city a fair chunk of money. Details to follow soon." I'm done with these idiots.
Take responsibility for yourselves TFC. Yes, the police may not have been 100% percent prepared. But, on the other hand they don't really expect World War III to set off every time you guys come to town. They might have done a couple things incorrectly. But, who was totally innocent on Saturday... Apparently TFC fans who just shrug off the following...
1.) A fan video of their fans jumping up and down on the back of the seating intentionally trying to break it (at the 0:24 mark):
2.) Some of their fans throwing a railing out of their section which could have hurt a photographer, ball boy, or security guard 20 feet below. The rest of the TFC fans look on disinterested:
3.) Setting off probably two dozen smoke bombs and a few flares. I'm all for it myself to an extent but security is going to give you problems if you do so. If they didn't we would have tons of them as well in our section. Quite a few have been kicked out of the Nordecke for it.
Also, some TFC fans were not keeping the smoke bombs in the section instead it seemed from my vantage point that some were directed at security below as well as their own goalie Greg Sutton as well. I'm cool with smoke bombs but not in the field of play. Goes for the one Crew fan as well who dropped one near the corner after our goal. If you set them off keep them in the stands or off the field. Someone who throws it on the field or elsewhere does so because they are unwilling to take responsibility for it.
4.) Comments like this from a 33 year old man with his four year old son getting beers thrown at them from Toronto fans after the game (3rd comment):
Crew Season ticket holder. sat in 124 all match. I very much enjoyed the match and the passion both sets of supporters added to the afternoon.
Here's where it gets dicey. I'm 33 with my 4yo in tow. He's also a season ticket holder and pretty well versed on match day. I'm not some crazy bible beating hardhead that says the match is for families. I love the passion. I love the Nordeke. My son understands people care about the score. BUT - when I try and get my son out of the stadium as fast as possible and get beers thrown at me from TFC fans on the concourse, it's officially gone too far. Come on - you should be OUTRAGED at the actions of your fans. YOUR fans. If your calling out ANYONE it should be YOUR fans.
I agree with you in that each set of supporters should be mature enough to get in and out of an away match without fighting and causing destruction. I'm pretty sure if DC rolled into Toronto and burned some of your field you'd be pretty upset (maybe you'd be happy). YOU HAVE A PROBLEM. I'll admit that Columbus needed to do some self policing of the Nordeke after the NE match last season. And the members took that VERY serious. I don't get that form TFC fans. I think all of you think you should be able to walk into other teams stadiums and throw beers at 4year olds and tear up the seating and pick fights with cops and everyone else should just get over it because your TFC.
Come on man.... it could all be so much better. WE, and I mean all of us, should be so much better....
I also heard from a friend that a teenage girl had to go to the hospital for a broken arm because she was pushed with enough force by some TFC fans that she fell over and broke her arm. Apparently the TFC fans were trying to run towards the chant off going on down near the concourse.
I also heard on Toronto's boards that some Barbarez fellow punched a Crew fan with enough force that he lost a bunch of teeth. I have no clue if it was deserved or not since I wasn't there, although I doubt anyone should lose their teeth at a soccer match.
And, I told everyone that if you want to avoid trouble, you can. Just move along and get away from anyone that is causing trouble. Some regular fan on the Crew boards along with his wife said they did just that by taking an alternative exit but were still acosted verbally by Toronto fans.
4.) I was around for the concourse thing and although I wasn't creating any problems as I was waiting for Chris Wilson of the Crew to ask him where I could store my two stick banners because I had no vehicle at Crew Stadium. I saw the whole scene. Chris was actually in the middle of it trying to break it up. Basically, security let a bunch of TFC fans down the main steps, then stopped them and let Crew fans down the steps, while another large contingent of TFC fans were up on top of the South End throwing down insults(which is fine, I returned serve on some) and throwing a beer at our heads which wasn't too cool, I got one right on me. Anyways, some of the first set of TFC fans down the steps stayed around when they could have easily have left (the new video below starting at the 4:40 mark you will see that they stay around for at least five minutes for no good reason when they easily could have left). They were throwing out insults, throwing some regular coins(not commerative's), and basically trying to bait Crew fans. Most of the Crew fans continued walking right towards the other exit until one Crew fan lost his cool from something said and the rest of the Crew fans followed him back. Then a chant off insued for the next what felt like 20 minutes as a few cops watched on for what felt like a good 10-15 minutes until a TFC fan (I think mistakenly) bumped into a Crew fan and then all hell broke loose for a second until the cop maced everyone in the radius. I was standing off to the side and I even got a little on the side of my face for watching, and I was probably a good 20-25 feet from where it happened. Am I complaining? No. Because it was my fault for standing around there and watching the spectacle. I could have been farther away and found Chris Wilson later.
Anyways, the cop could have got some of his buddies and tried to form a barrier and then march towards one group to end it. But, he still did the right thing at the time by dispersing the crowd. He asked on multiple occasions for the two sides to disperse I believe but being outnumbered, the two sides didn't listen too well.
Basically, in this new video what you got here is a pretty decent size crowd of 30-60 TFC fans standing in the below concourse waiting for something from the 4:40 mark to the 9:29 mark, basically five minutes right there. They could have easily and should have easily of left the concourse right away:
Instead they were throwing insults, coins, and chanting trying to bait and excite some Crew fans and they got what they wished for. If your trying to cause trouble then why complain if your maced or arrested. If your watching the spectacle when you could easily have moved along (I know of a couple of the most peaceful Crew fans I met got maced pretty badly for being in the area) then your at fault as well for not moving along.
6.) I don't really think the cops tase anyone for no complete reason (especially if he was friends with this guy and it seems like he was). The cops told the TFC fans to move along many times outside the stadium and from the video(I couldn't tell myself as I was collecting my banners in the section at that point and missed everything that happened outside the gates) it seems like they didn't move along. When you disobey a cops orders then it's your fault. I don't know if only Americans take those seriously, but if a cop told me personally on multiple occasions to move along I would damn sure listen.
In the end, the cops may not have done everything completely 100% percent correctly. But, did TFC fans act anywhere near 100% percent perfect angels? No. And, did anyone get badly hurt? No, so they did their job in that respect. Also, Crew fans were not complete angels and some should have tried a little harder not to be baited so easily by some TFC idiots. But, nevertheless when are TFC fans going to realize that they were more then a little at fault on Saturday? Heck, I would really to be honest blame 50% percent on them, 25% on the cops underreacting and then overreacting, and then 25% percent on some easily offended Crew fans that got baited into the whole thing.
I wanted to just let this go away and move along. TFC took their beating in their own papers and everyone was over it. But, this paragraph is just ludicrous, "As I write this, TFC supporters’ groups are finalizing a formal response to the city of Columbus, Ohio, and its threat-happy police force. It’s simple, practical, and will cost the Columbus Crew soccer team and their city a fair chunk of money. Details to follow soon."
So, wait the Columbus Crew should pay TFC supporters for ruining their bleachers, throwing their railings, and creating the majority of the disturbances inside their stadium. If I was the City of Columbus and the Columbus Crew I would respond with a big "screw you."
Also, I was part of the 110 fans who were escorted by Toronto police straight into the waiting arms of a bunch(I would say at least 300 young TFC fans) looking to cause trouble last September. Out of the 110 fans there were 5 or 6 families as well as about 50/50 male and female fans, It wasn't like the Crew took an all HSH bus. Contrast that with this past Saturday, it wasn't like Columbus police escorted all the Toronto fans into a waiting line of the hardest looking Crew fans. Did the Crew fans write a formal response to the city of Toronto and Toronto FC expecting them to pay a whole bunch of money. No we took it and moved on.
If you got maced, tased, or arrested last week chances are you could have avoided it if you actually tried by walking straight to your car or bus. Unbelievable for all the trouble and damage they caused Crew Stadium that they won't take any personal responsibility for their actions and rather lump it all on Columbus police and the Columbus Crew.
Instead of making them pay, why not just make sure all TFC or any away fans in any MLS stadium stay in their section for 30 minutes until the home side clears out. That is the only solution for these problems.
4/3/09: You Know I've Been Kind.. But, Take Responsibility For Yourselves TFC Fans Instead Of Blaming Everyone Else
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5 comments:
I didn't know that they actually threw the railing. That's a bit over the top. I don't know how they could possible expect Columbus to pay for the damages that their fans caused before the fuzz even got involved...
Well, it's probably not a lawsuit. I think they expect the Crew to pay because TFC supporters just won't show up. Although I don't get how they think they are not at fault at all. I mean if they can't come and act responsible then fine don't come at all. Sure, the Crew likes there money. But, they like their regular civilian fans as well. And, I bet some new Columbus fans were turned off by it all.
Also, we have survived before they were in the league. We have USA vs Mexico and make good money off of that. As well as some good money off the upcoming Gold Cup probably. If they don't come we can survive just fine with 2,000 less tickets sold a year.
This may be the most balanced writing I've seen on the subject. What strikes me as far more embarrassing than the actions of a few a the game was the refusal of the majority to admit to the truth of what happened. It's amazing to me that the author of the remarks about the TFC fan proposal to the Crew and its associated costs, seems to think it will be cause for concern in Columbus. What a dick eh?
Yeah man. I have been fair and cool headed about this from the start. I do think the Crew fans and the Police were responsible as well. Maybe I was off on 50%, 25%, 25%. But, it's at least 33%, 33%, 33% between the three groups. That's what I should have wrote. Just man up for your third TFC. We will do what we can to make it less possible with our groups, Columbus Police said themselves in the Sun that they have no tactical plan for Crew games like OSU vs. Michigan but they are developing one now for at least when TFC comes to town along with other rival fans, and then TFC has to take care of their 33% percent by telling all of their supporters(if it's not regulated by MLS) to stay in your section for 30 minutes after the game. That way if the home fans get at you, you look bigger because you stayed in your section and the home fans were obviously looking for the trouble by coming in your section.
I know it's hard to control 2,000 people. I don't condone people throwing beer cups on the field for us. But, more needs to be done by the leaders to at least try. When we are not focused on the play and actually see who throws something we point them out to security. Even had an asshole chant for one guy. That kind of went to the wayside against TFC. So we have things to work on as well.
yawn
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